ENG205- may 16 2012
First half is definitions
Second half is short analysis of a small speech we have not seen before and must
answer questions about it.
Was born around the time Gorgias came into Athens and was born into an
Was particularly interested in mathematics, geometrics and abstracts; saw them
as the path to truths
He believed that there is a Truth out there
o There are aspects out there that do not change
Interested in large abstract questions
o What is beauty?
o What is truth?
He had the idea that you could find the answer to these questions, although it
may not be easy.
Plato was interested in the abstraction- he called them the idea or form
PARABLE OF THE CAVE
Someone who is about finding what is real
The true art
Rhetoric was a tekne
o Plato disagreed with that point of view
Socrates had this notion that people were way to confident in what they believed.
o Challenged them
There is a complex, fictional version of these characters, Plato is not giving us a
Plato hated rhetoric so much because Socrates died from it, and he was
devastated from Socrates’ death.
o It also had to do with social class- he was born into an Aristocratic class
THE TEXT P. 89
Socrates asks the most important question: what is the point of rhetoric?
o What does it do?
The art and the product have the relationship of making something real and
making it useful
Socrates is starting with that tekne needs an art and a product
Gorgias has locked down what rhetoric produces
o Shocking how long it takes him to say this
Plato’s version of the conversation is making Socrates is manipulating Gorgias
into answering however Socrates wants him to
Socrates knocking down Gorgias in the attempt to discredit Gorgias who
DIALECTIC- Plato pioneers dialectic; in o