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Chapter 2

POL200Y1 Chapter 2: Thucydides' On Justice, pages 66-76, 89-95, 102-109, 111-123

Political Science
Course Code
Ryan Balot

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Complicated political phenomenon
'Athenians hopeful beyond power'
Hope and danger
Athenian character
Athenians turned league into an empire
Money kept in Athens
Mytilenans were powerful --> gave ships expertise in naval affairs, an important ally
Set standard for rest of league
Athens wanted to kill all my men --> Spartans took too long to arrive and fight
Next morning, they change their minds
Everyone nervous whether or not they can stop
Main leader after Pericles
Combative - not actually a fighter
No surrender
Democracy: orator telling how dumb people are to listen to speeches -->
terrify from speaking
Need to admit that this is tyranny and nothing else
Treat everyone as guilty
Can't eliminate, just solve
People will rebel in future
Only care about interests
Not going to talk about justice
They will help in future of war
Divide - turn against each other
Defends democracy: good for Athens, good man has to lie
Behind closed doors
ineffective? Still talk about justice / hope
Maintains request
No public eye - be honest
Most important part of book
Melians have no power --> extreme inequality
Leaders / diplomats - only council
103: Athenian: strong do what they can, weak suffer what they must --> we are
powerful, you must obey
Athenians dispute hope 'comfort and danger'
surprised that Melians will believe Gods will help them
No reason to think Gods will save them
Spartans won't bother to save you
'Gods rule where they can'
Athenians have made proposal: take down walls and we won't destroy you -->
105: Melians: trying to persuade not to attack, end up saying they hope (1)
Spartans help (2) Gods
Tutorial 2
December 23, 2016
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